The other day, I was having a conversation with a very wise woman. She is both wise in her faith and wise in her years – a mother, a grandparent, and a spiritual shepherd of many women.
We were talking about church attendance, and people new to the faith, and people familiar and strong in the faith, and sheep and shepherds.
I started thinking about the words I have heard so many say, “I’m not being fed,” and the defensive, reactionary responses the other many shoot back…
“Feed yourself.”
While yes, if we look at the metaphors, babies need milk and adults need meat.
But the bottom line of our conversation was this:
We all need to eat.
And to say, “feed yourself,” well, I found myself asking if that is a statement diametrically opposed to Biblical relationships and what Galatians says about carrying each others’ burdens?
Shouldn’t we be feeding each other?
To keep with the metaphor, shouldn’t we be looking around us, finding the weaker sheep and taking them to a spot with more grass? More life? The stronger of us can maybe go a day or two longer or leaner but the point of it is to be aware of each other and what we need?
Because we all need…shouldn’t we help each other find nourishment instead of getting judgmental about it?
I realize some pastors get defensive and say that “not getting fed” means someone is just lazy…that they aren’t picking up their Bible at home or aren’t engaged in relationships.
While there are people that certainly fit that description, there are others that are quite the opposite…the more they dig into daily spiritual discipline, the more they realize what used to feed doesn’t nourish anymore…
When you’re hungry, sure, any kind of food will keep you alive for a while…but you can’t always eat one thing. Your diet has to be balanced and healthy.
All sheep need grass.
And all shepherds should care for their sheep.
And shouldn’t all fields provide a level of sustainable nourishment?
Comments
92 responses to “All Sheep Need Grass”
Good thoughts Anne. As a pastor I struggle with the people who leave after a worship experience or leave the church for good and say, “I didn’t get anything from that today.” Or “I am not being fed so I will be attending so-and-so church now” (if they show enough grace to even say something). Many churches have become hog troughs and people are feeding only themselves. But I digress…sorry. I am wondering if maybe people feeding themselves so much i.e. personal but no group, is one of the reasons we have a proliferation of cults and also splits and break offs from churches. I do appreciate your probing thoughts here and agree (so much more to write). :)
.-= Bill (cycleguy)?s last blog ..Being Real =-.
Just to clarify and make sure I understand your comment correctly….in the post I’m saying that we ARE responsible for feeding each other. If someone is not getting nourishment from one place in part of their journey, why shouldn’t they find it? Why shouldn’t we help them find it?
Wat you are talking about I call that the wow factor: http://thoughtsaboutnothing.com/the-wow-factor/
Like…the church is anemic because of wow moments and not consistency?
I agree with Kyle. We’ve become so caught up in making people go wow so we can get them to come back that we’ve neglected the gospel and the teaching of it. I call it the butts-bucks phenomenon. In order to get more bucks, you need more butts in the seats, which leads to more bucks in the plate, which leads to more butts in the seats…it’s an endless cycle! But what you’re saying here Anne is that we have a responsibility to feed each other. Discipleship. It’s a lost art form in our world today, in my opinion.
.-= Kevin?s last blog ..Religion. =-.
Pretty much, really the post is about the idea that we are constantly going after wow moments in a service, trying to impress and blow people away, but in all reality we are missing the point in the fact that the wow moment should be the story of Christ dying for sinners.
I contrasted that all with James Cameron’s movie Avatar to kind of make my point in the fact that he used the story to bring the wow moments.
I am really bad at grasping the obvious!!! Sorry!!
Nice word and reminder Anne. As a pastor when I hear the term “I’m not being fed” I have visions from the past of a grumpy 60-ish man holding his Bible who really meant he did not like my style of preaching. He was not a weaker sheep, but a pain-in-the-butt sheep. However, as you say there are weaker sheep all around us that need love, care, and feeding. If our attitude is “feed yourself” we will surely miss caring for many precious sheep in our pasture.
No doubt, the faith journey is meant to be done in community – going solo, I think, would have been incomprehensible to our forerunners from the first century who established our foundations. We absolutely should invest ourselves in other believers as we are able (to borrow a Wesley-ish sort of phrase :)).
That said…the presence of a consumer Christianity mentality in the U.S. is undeniable. I have to agree with something John Ortberg said years ago in a message (paraphrasing): Not being fed?! You’ve been a Christ follower for 20 years. Get out of the hi-chair, take off the bib, and start feeding yourself! He got a lot of laughs, but there is truth underlying those laughs. God, I feel confident, does not intend for the whole of our transformation to occur during the time we spend in a sanctuary/auditorium seat on Sunday morning. :)
Thanks for helping my brain get warmed-up this AM…
John,
What Ortberg said is exactly the opposite of what Anne is saying in her post. If someone has been a believer for 20 years and is still in a “high-chair” that is a serious indictment on the community of faith that person is a part of. To be more exact with Ortberg’s analogy, a child does not just jump out of a high chair; growth and development are not automatic. Loving parents teach children to sit up, to feed themselves, then to cook and feed others. Without that loving care, that nurture, training, and habituation, the child will not develop. Children who are neglected during their developmental years have a very difficult time later learning these very things. I don’t share your confidence that God wants us to grow on our own, the emphasis of the NT is clearly on growth in and as a community. I think a key problem we have in the American church today is there are far too many spritiually-feral children (keeping with the analogy). We should all hear the words of Jesus to Peter: “Feed my lambs, tend my sheep, feed my sheep.” We need to be faithful shepherds to his sheep, or else we will face the rebuke that the shepherds of Israel received in Ezekiel 34.
Mike
.-= Mike Raburn?s last blog ..meeting God at the changing table =-.
Yep. I love Ortberg, but that quote never landed with me.
Hey, Mike ~
It would seem my words were misunderstood: 1) Ortberg’s comment, firstly, is meant to be humorous; secondly, his point is addressed to those who ARE capable of growth without it being “spoon fed”; and, 2) my first sentence clearly states that I DO NOT align with the argument that the with-God life can be done well outside community.
John
Amen! We absolutely need to feed each other. God gives certain revelations on a passage of scripture so we can share it with others, that way we all grow.
.-= Alan Crookham?s last blog ..And the Blind Recieve Their Sight =-.
I always respond when I see the name Crookham. I have been researching my Crookham roots for 12 years now. Would love to hear who your family is. I’m willing to share my research with others. Please email me
Diane
dianet51@gmail.com
Awesome! I find that when I help others, I myself become fed. I think that part of the feeding ourselves IS feeding others. It’s part of the balanced diet of Christian living.
.-= Brett Barner?s last blog ..Are We Done With Christmas Yet? =-.
I really like this post. I have found myself thinking about this very topic a lot lately. I moved almost 5 years ago, leaving my home church that was in my opinion one of the best churches in the country. Today although I love my new life and my new city, I haven’t been fed the way I was back home. I have been trying to “feed myself” but believe that what has been feeding me in my new home isn’t as nourishing as it was when I first got here. I’d love to hear more of your thoughts on this topic. Should I switch churches? Should I stick it out? Thanks for the challenging post this morning!
.-= Tara?s last blog ..Cleaning Out the Clutter =-.
Anne: This is a HUGELY insightful post. I agree there are times when I sit around saying: “I’m not getting fed!!” and other times when I’m feeding myself and not helping feed others.
I’ve been noticing the difference lately between adult food and baby food (metaphorically). As I progress in my faith journey, I sense the difference between the two. How my soul LONGS for real, nourishing, adult food!
Anyways, great post. I just listened to Craig Groeschel talk about his own experience with his wife and how they longed for a Christian community. My wife and I have felt “bad” about this need for some time. But it’s real. It’s valid. And churches need to help find these “pastures” for one another, right?
.-= John Alexander?s last blog ..TrustQuotient =-.
Great Post! I think you hit the nail on the head when you speak of balance. We need a healthy balance in sources of food. We need to be preached to and taught the word of God by the spiritual authority that God has placed in our lives. We need to feed and be fed by healthy fellowship with our fellow believers. And at some point, the Christian has to learn to feed himself/herself. A healthy balance of these three will provide the greatest nourishment.
Yes! I think the balance of the three is a HUGE point here. I was attending a church where I was part of leading a group (marriage group & heading a kid’s sports ministry) that fed others… and I was also feeding myself at home (personal worship & study). However I was hugely frustrated by the lack of teaching from the pulpit. There was an imbalance. I tried to make it work at that church for 5 years. After that time I just felt extremely deflated. I think you need strong components of ALL three. If you’re missing any one of them I think after time you begin to really feel & see the effects.
.-= Michelle Sidles?s last blog ..Action in the Bathroom =-.
I, too often, find myself being the judgmental person in this scenario. I was saved as an adult, never having attended church, and couldn’t get enough from that moment on. I was constantly reading, studying, or picking someone’s brain. As a result, I found it hard to have any sympathy for those who would say “I’m not getting fed.” Your post is a good reminder I need to be more sensitive to these people, while not enabling people who simply refuse to pursue the wisdom of God in their own lives. Thanks!
Anne,
I totally agree. People do need to take responsibility to feed themselves. I think we, as Christ disciples, are called to help them… and encourage them. Sometimes that means helping them find another pasture to graze in.
–Terrace Crawford
http://www.terracecrawford.com
http://www.twitter.com/terracecrawford
.-= Terrace Crawford?s last blog ..Manic Monday Minute =-.
Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. This is a very affirming post. I have been whining lately not about being spiritually hungry (which I am), but about being spiritually thirsty. parched. We moved to a new area and are having a very difficult time finding a church. I am in NC and my closest mentor is in Omaha. I am trying to quench my thirst, but we truly need others to help. We need the accountability. The community. the challenge to help and be helped.
.-= Chris K?s last blog ..Know God – Jumping in… =-.
These are great thoughts Anne, and something I am an advocate for. I want to be fed SO I can feed others. Does that make sense? For how can we continue to give, if we aren’t receiving anything….to continually give out something has to be going in.
.-= Laura Anne?s last undefined ..If you register your site for free at =-.
Agreed. No qualifications or caveats necessary.
.-= Kenyon?s last blog ..RIGHT NOW =-.
Thanks Anne. Thought provoking post. I agree with your premise that the church should help each other – I like the analogy of bring fellow sheep to places with richer patches of grass. My only caveat (sorry Kenyon) is that I think the sourcer of all the grass is God’s Word and His Spirit. That is what really satisfies the sheep. Deep relationship with the Food Source. Therefore, we as sheep can best help other sheep eat by living full of the Spirit and full of the Word – ready to share truth at the Spirit’s prompting. Again, I really appreciate you and your thoughts. God bless.
I desperately needed to hear this and realize I’m not taking crazy pills with the way I’ve been feeling about this exact issue lately. Thanks SO MUCH!
Hey Anne et. al,
I am on the train too – helping others is an intimate, if not foundational part of the Christian faith. All too often we don’t realize that a large part of the message of Jesus tries to get us to see that humanity is connected and that living according to His way is living according to a selfless, investment oriented life.
On the other hand “you can lead a horse (sheep) to water (grass) but you can’t make it drink (eat)”. I think that’s the part of the puzzle that many pastors face – they’re doing their best to present biblical food to the sheep and yet the sheep are looking for something else that doesn’t provide real nourishment. Instead of grass, which isn’t very tasty but is very good for sheep they want to eat plastic because it’s different or shiny but in the end not very good for them.
So how does one discern when it’s not the food’s fault but the sheep’s willingness to eat the right food that is the real problem. I sense far more people leaving churches for want of the wrong things than the right things.
“Who is expected to feed the pastor?” “How does the pastor ‘get fed’”?
.-= Jim Kane?s last blog ..I Give Up! =-.
In my opinion the pastor is a member of the body like any other person there.
They should get fed by engaging in relationships with others in the same fashion.
I know our pastor also has a support community of other pastors that helps to ‘feed’ him. That could be helpful.
.-= Danny Bixby?s last blog ..The Gospel According to Lost =-.
Great thoughts!!!!
Divinely brought up!
I like this a lot Anne.
I’ve often thought of the “people need to feed themselves” to be mostly reactionary and defensive.
It’s true that people do need to be responsible for eating, but I like that we all need to be responsible for the provision of food.
Agreed that there are more people who need to be in the business of feeding other than just the pastor or staff.
.-= Danny Bixby?s last blog ..The Gospel According to Lost =-.
Great thoughts. I agree that we should point them to where there is more grass, which is why we have small groups. However, I still believe it is a matter of the heart. Sometimes there is just a lack of understanding. That’s when it is a perfect time to clarify anything. But if they offer up another excuse, then I know they are not committed to being fed.
I wouldn’t agree that “small groups” are the answer…that “model” has never been a good thing for my husband and me. People are created differently, learn differently, and relate differently. We have a group of friends that we live our lives with and none of us really go to the same church or even are of the same branch (Orthodox, protestant, anglican, etc.) I don’t think plugging people into a program is the answer. Just a tangent. :)
Some people aren’t willing to be fed, but others are starving to death desperate, doing what they can to eat in often barren fields.
Thank you Anne! This exactly how things are working out for my husband and I, we can’t seem to click into the small groups that our church is gung ho over, but when we accidently got together with a group of people from all over, it clicked and works for us. Even without actually “meeting” regularly, just keeping in touch.
.-= V. Higgins?s last blog ..Slowly creating new language in my heart… =-.
I kind of agree with Anne. Overall I like the concept of small groups but what I don’t like is that the church doesn’t prepare the groups. Sometimes they just shove them in a group and say here you go. Or even when I group forms on their own, what resources does the church give them to learn?
A group of guys I meet with was trying to figure out what we wanted to study next. We have been good about going out and finding our own material but how many groups don’t know they can do this. Is just reading the Bible enough? Can you learn and hear God from just reading it? How do you study it?
Just a couple of thoughts.
dj
.-= Darrell Jordan?s last blog ..Tomorrow is never promised. =-.
I think your post is hitting on the importance of teaching people how to feed themselves, even if that process takes a lot of time. I’ve been struck by how many Christians I’ve met have had either negative experiences of the Bible or simply just don’t know where to begin, and so they are afraid or unwilling to dive into it. To the degree that we can help those folks not only help themselves, but also help others, I think there’s much to be done here. Thanks for sharing these thoughts.
I don’t think at any point we should create people to be independent feeders — we need to be interdependent.
This is it right here!
Agreed. That’s what I was trying to say in my second to last sentence. Interdependent is a great word choice.
I teach college girls who’ve been taught all their life that if they’re not getting anything out of church it’s their fault. But I go to their church and I KNOW it’s not their fault. They’re convinced that they’re just bad Christians, that they don’t love God enough. I HATE this. But I’m doing my best to make sure they get fed. If it isn’t during worship, fine. Just so long as they’re eating.
.-= Jennifer Gerhardt?s last blog ..Let’s Build a Porn Bonfire =-.
Tim, you took the metaphor right out of my mouth! I agree that we should be sensitive to our fellow sheep and always endeavor to help the younger or weaker in their walk with Christ, but there is always personal choice and responsibility. Is “not being fed” a valid excuse? Sometimes. Maybe. But there are so many rich resources available through books, online messages/podcasts, etc. If you are hungry, just open your mouth wide and the Lord will fill it! Ps. 81:10 On the flip side,we are commanded to love one another, this includes making sure everyone is included in eating in rich pastures. Besides, isn’t more exciting to bring someone along with you to enjoy what you’ve found? Spiritually mentoring someone is a wonderful thing!The Navigators ministry was instrumental in showing me that it’s not enough just to lead someone to the Lord. We need to disciple them as well.
totally agree!
Hi Anne,
I think expectation also has much to do with this topic – not so much the “feed me/I’m not being fed” language, but the understanding that the Christian life is a journey/marathon with ebbs and flows.
I think we’ve presented spiritual growth as a linear journey or stepped journey, but I’ve found it to be much more a rhythmic/seasonal thing. I go through seasons of drought (and doubt) and seasons of feasting. I don’t think this is the whole answer, by any means, but I think it is an added dynamic to the whole grass/food/responsibility discussion.
.-= Steve Cuss?s last blog ..Honest Questions for Honest Evolutionists =-.
something i’ve shared often with my staff team is that as a leader, i am not responsible for them, but i am responsible to them.
i’m responsible to them in the sense of creating an environment that is conducive for personal and spiritual growth and providing as many platforms for “nourishment” as i possibly can. but i am not responsible for them.
they alone are responsible for their own growth and development. what they do with the opportunities provided is their own choice.
.-= alece?s last blog ..have you ever =-.
I guess this is why I have difficulty with the sermon-based church model. The assumption is that folks come to church to “get fed” by the pastor’s preaching and/or have their “spirits lifted” by the worship band. I tend to appreciate a Eucharist-centered/liturgical worship that understands we are fed by the One who was the Bread of Life. This is not to disparage other churches–just to draw attention to the difference in reference points.
Great post and questions. I believe it’s a both/and situation. On one hand, sheep need to know how to feed themselves spiritual via Scripture and any disciplines that encourage a deeper relationship with Jesus. But God has also provided those in the body of Christ to equip the saints for ministry (outward focus). In our daily spheres of influence, I believe there are people God has placed in our lives who “feed” us through their witness.
The American church is stuffed but churches in lesser developed parts of the world are making a greater impacts and seeing more people receive Christ because they understand one important principle: You have to work out and walk out what you feed on.
.-= missional girl?s last blog ..Something About Joseph, Pt. 2 =-.
Remember John 21?
Do you love me? Then feed my lambs.
Do you love me? Then tend my sheep.
Do you really love me? Then feed my sheep.
My question to all is: is Christ simply speaking to the disciple and this commandment is meant for those who are to equip the saints?
-OR-
In the light of the Great Commission, wouldn’t this commandment be for all of those who proclaim to love Jesus as their Lord and Savior.
.-= Joseph Louthan?s last blog ..What If We Could Not Be Moved? =-.
Excellent piece Anne. My own pastor is one of those defensive types and to me that is sad. He’s great for newer Christians and yes it is difficult to meet so many diverse needs in so many people and still…
I’ve tried to combat this by 1. Offering an in depth Bible Study for women in my own church and 2. Attending a high liturgical church for early service before going to our home church. There is something about that service that feeds my Spirit. And it just feels good some times to sit and worship without being asked if this or that (church work thing) was taken care of and where do we stand with X.. etc.. Seems strange, I know. But it helps.
Love your writing and your heart.
I have found that since I am walking more intimately with God, I am not so much dependent on [other people / pastors / religious institutions] for nourishment. I have found that the Living Water I receive from Christ far surpasses anything I have ever heard from a pulpit or fellow church goer. Sure, I still fellowship with my brothers and sisters, not out of duty, but out of love for them, and their love for me.
I think that if our perspective is correct, that we are helping others to be more intimate with and walk closer to God, and Him alone, as the ‘helping them find greener pasture’, then yes, that is what we need to be doing.
We are all gonna be really surprised when we get to heaven and find out all God really ever wanted to do was, walk with us in the Garden.
.-= Rocco?s last blog ..Rain… =-.
wonderful!!!
Good thoughts here Anne.
There are definitely people in our churches who use the “I’m not being fed” line to blow off their own personal responsibility for their spiritual growth. Leaders have to be sensitive to who they might be hearing statement like that from. Once they know, they’ll know how to deal with the individuals.
Another thing is that pastors don’t teach enough on spiritual disciplines. We talk about them & tell people to develop them but we don’t teach it enough. It’s true, using the same Bible reading plan for 20 years will probably get stale. Praying exactly the same way all the time will lose its vibrancy. That’s where creatively teaching about these disciplines & how to implement & develop them has to take some priority in the teaching schedule of leaders.
Matt
Totally agree, Anne, that we should be feeding each other and helping the weak/new among us.
I think part of the problem, and why that phrase strikes so many of us in ministry the wrong way, is that many times (at least in my limited ministry experience) the people that use that phrase actually are the lazy ones who think the pastor should spoon-feed them forever.
It seems that the sheep who are new and/or weaker, but genuinely interested in “being fed,” find help. I’ve never heard a new believer who didn’t know where to start, or what to do next say, “I’m not being fed.” I’ve only ever heard it used by someone who has been a “Christian” for decades when they’re leaving a church they don’t get along with anymore.
Reminds me of another familiar phrase, with a similar analogy: You can lead a horse to water (or in this case a sheep to pasture), but you can’t make him drink.
.-= Lex?s last blog ..What is Righteousness? =-.
Perhaps the question is more of whether we should be able to feed ourselves but learning to eat WITH others.
I always think of the SNL skit “Bird Family”. The mom and dad always chew the food and then spit it into their kids mouths. One of the kids brings a college girlfriend home for the first time, and the results are hilarious.
I think the question is whether or not we know how to feed ourselves, but we do need to be able to eat with others.
Wow.
.-= Rocco?s last blog ..Rain… =-.
To me this describes mentoring and the need for mentoring.
For a long time I think we have been very dependent on the church to feed us, unfortunately that does not happen and often can leave you very disappointed (at least for me).
I have been searching for some food to eat and have had a hard time finding anything outside of books, surface level mentoring, and the God.
Very important conversation here.
Yes, all preachers/teachers have a responsibility to “feed the sheep” from the Word of God. Many sermons leave the sheep with a challenge to live out the scripture that was preached about, so that part, living it out in the week that is ahead, is up to each sheep. Let’s assume that a pastor isn’t feeding his people from the word. Sure, they will get hungry eventually, but do they look elsewhere for spiritual food or talk to the pastor about his lack of “setting food on the table?” If enough sheep get tired of going hungry and expressing their need for spiritual food to the pastor often enough, will that be sufficient to change his preaching/teaching? Probably not – most pastors get locked into a routine and follow that ‘religiously.’ So, the only solution is to find a pastor that does feed his members and join that church.
There are always two things that indicate the spiritual temperature of a church: money and attendance. If either begins to flag, the pastor must look around and see why. If he doesn’t, he will soon be without 1)a congregation, and 2)a paycheck.
Anne,
THANK YOU for writing this post. I just got off the phone with my brother where we talked about this VERY issue.
I think I have a different view on this.
I have heard it both ways, from the “I’m not getting fed” person and the “Feed yourself” or “Feed each other” preachers.
As a young pastor, I find myself struggling with this, personally. Helping lead a church (I am not the lead pastor, and preach sporadically, not regularly) is freakin’ hard and spiritually draining.
Life is draining, work is draining, kids are draining. I understand those who go looking for grass because they don’t feel fed. Life is tough, and we need nourishment.
I feel the pastor’s role is shifting in this generation from delivering great messages to identifying leaders who can strategically be involved in feeding the flock. Like Kyle said, this is commonly identified as mentoring.
Mentoring is leading is pastoring is shepherding.
This can’t be programmed, but has to be addressed with church leadership regularly.
I think it has to be addressed with the CHURCH regularly. The Church has become so staff-driven/led that many of us are blind, just waiting to be led somewhere. We should help each other, and the time has got to come where we can’t (and shouldn’t) be depending on staff. If that makes sense.
That make a lot of sense, and I couldn’t agree more. You are right, in that it can’t be about the church leadership but the church itself.
The role of the pastor has to shift to enabling and encouraging people to dive into each others lives and get the focus on the church, not the staff.
It has to be us pointing collectively to God, not us pointing to Preacher who is pointing to God.
Thanks again for this post.
I see one of my main responsibilities as church leadership/staff to be not needed. Helping people connect to each other, not the staff.
.-= Sam Mahlstadt?s last blog ..Rob Bell on Finding God =-.
I didn’t become a Christian until I was 21, and I was like the other commenter who was a starving, avid eater (and still am). I couldn’t believe the great good fortune I had in finding a church that taught the Bible in such a way that it came alive for me for the first time (and continues to do so 18 years later).
I have a hard time understanding people who expect a “meal” once a week to feed them, but don’t take classes, serve, or engage with other people in church community. It’s difficult to realize that there just is a small percentage of people who seem to need something new (such as a new person giving the sermon), rather than being able to deepen in their walk with a community of believers over time. Those same people will probably end up ‘not being fed’ at their new church 8-10 years down the road.
I came to a place years ago where I knew I’d have to feed myself because for the most part the church structure just lacks the ability to feed most people truly hungry for God. The pastors are overworked, the staff for churches is overwhelmed trying to keep the pastors from burning out and small group leaders rarely are “leaders” but folks who just don’t want to have someone else running the show for what they feel they must be doing to be part of a church. In fact, in my 15+ years of being a believer I can think of two small groups where I actually felt fed enough to grow.
I think it helps to reach the point where you know the “church” can’t feed all your needs. At that point, you begin to look for what God wants you to learn all around you and not just what’s in the program Sunday morning & Wednesday nights.
.-= Jason?s last blog ..31 Days in Proverbs Day 7: We need to be a Gambini =-.
Great discussion. Thanks for the post, Anne! Like most things, I think context is key. Who is saying “I’m not getting fed”, what do they mean, and why are they saying it?
There are times when people say this and what they are trying to do is make you responsible for their spiritual growth. There are other times when, legitimately, the teaching ministry of a particular church is anemic. There are still other times when the person is seeking after God, searching the scriptures, and legitimately wants help. There are still other times when people say “I’m not being fed” as an excuse to leave a church. And, I’m certain there are more…
The pastoral task require that we don’t assume we know what the person means. It requires moving towards the person in relationship not getting defensive and separating from the person(s). It requires listening so you understand. Then, and only then, can we respond thoughtfully. If the other person isn’t willing to engage at this level, there isn’t much more we can do.
I don’t take responsibility for another person’s spiritual growth. In the end, your faith is not my fault. I do take responsibility for my teaching, the teaching ministry of the church, the relational context of our community, and the various ways people learn best.
A cliche and two variations: You can lead a horse to water, but you can’t make them drink. You lead a horse to a dry creek, and even if they want to, they can’t drink. If you lead the horse to a dry creek and think it’s full of water, you’re delusional and your horse should run away the first chance it gets.
-michael
.-= michaeldanner?s last blog ..Flying bacteria, Batman! =-.
I see what you’re saying, and I tend to agree that growth happens in relationships and community, not in a vacuum. But sometimes I think people who leave over “not being fed” really mean I’m not as emotionally moved here as I am over there.
What do you do when someone is being fed, but they feel that some greener grasses would perhaps make them feel more full at the moment?
.-= Brandon Cox?s last blog ..God, Forgive Our Youthful Arrogance =-.
I’m not sure if one can determine if another person is being fed – watchfully aware if they aren’t producing fruit, but deep in their soul they will know (assuming that they really aren’t)…
For instance, I have been protestant my whole life. Ain’t nothing wrong with that. For several years my husband and I have been longing for something spiritual and we’ve tried different things.
We went this Sunday to an Anglican church and it was unlike anything I could have ever expected (I was scared to death, to begin with). But focusing on the Eucharist/the Altar, communal prayers and confession — this is what we needed as a couple. We didn’t even know how to verbalize what we needed to grow next…but we knew.
It wasn’t that we weren’t “getting fed” at our other church. I love our church and the people there and it’s Biblical and everything. God may be calling us into a different season where a different “grass” is what we need for nourishment….
Great post, Anne…
I’ve wrestled with issues such as this myself, and it always brings me back to the underlying problem with the Top-Down, Programmatic approach to ministry that many churches adopt.
Ephesians 4:11-16 completely contradicts this method of ministry. Needs of the church, community, etc. are met through the Body, and not just for them. In turn, as leaders equip other members (feed) to do ministry, the leaders themselves have the opportunity to be fed. Sounds like a organism to me…not an organization. Me likey.
-http://www.contentunderpressure.net (sorry for the plug, but Comluv is having trouble with my feed)
(Verse for context) Ephesians 4:11-16 (ESV)
11And he gave the apostles, the prophets, the evangelists, the shepherds and teachers,12 to equip the saints for the work of ministry, for building up the body of Christ, 13until we all attain to the unity of the faith and of the knowledge of the Son of God to mature manhood, to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ, 14so that we may no longer be children, tossed to and fro by the waves and carried about by every wind of doctrine, by human cunning, by craftiness in deceitful schemes. 15Rather, speaking the truth in love, we are to grow up in every way into him who is the head, into Christ, 16 from whom the whole body, joined and held together by every joint with which it is equipped, when each part is working properly, makes the body grow so that it builds itself up in love.
thanks for this post, Anne! this very topic has been heavy on my heart as of late!
.-= lisa?s last blog ..Plan B =-.
I have long been a person who favoures the get off your butt and feed yourself approach to spiritual growth and formation…possibly because I was in a place where I really wasn’t being fed. However I agree wholeheartedly with what you are saying. I believe we DO need to make sure those in our community are being fed…(actually I think the two must go hand in hand, we can’t abdicate our feeding to others forever, but there are times when we just can’t feed ourselves) however your approach requires a degree of transparency and interdependence that is pretty much non-existent in a great many of the churches that I have had contact with.
me again :) … there seem to be a lot of people talking about leaving churches if they are not being fed…are you saying that this is not a legitimate reason to leave a church? What is the purpose of the church?
.-= Michelle George?s last blog ..Happy Anniversary Babe! =-.
I think it can be a reason.
Good thoughts – thanks for sharing them. The idea that we should be helping others find nourishment is right and true, yet I still feel I need to ponder this one. (As in, how should I personally do this?) It’s all part of living in relationship with God and others – living in community means that we have a responsibility to help/serve others, but also that we can rely on others to help/serve us.
My understanding of John 10 is that Jesus is the Good Shepherd, not my pastor. I think the pressure we’ve put on preachers to “feed” us in some ways is misguided. Similarly, it’s not up to me to feed myself, either. Jesus being Lord is (or should be) a daily, practical reality for all of us. I don’t say this to shame anyone. Lord knows that I need to let go and be fed (much like a baby fights a parent from shoveling strained peas into its mouth). But I think that it’s important to go the source of life that we’re all seeking. What I mean by that is that without the Shepherd, sheep would have no idea where to graze (or where to go once they ate all the grass in the field). Good blog, Anne.
.-= Jeff?s last blog ..Top Ten Wrecked Posts of 2009 =-.
Actually, I haven’t been part of a church in my small town for years. I got fed up with the power struggles that seem to consume the churches in my area, and I was tired of the focus of the Gospel being on dying and going to Heaven. Not going to church has not affected my walk with God at all. I have found plenty of food in the Bible and have never gotten tired of feasting on the underlying concepts found in its pages.
Hebrews 8:9-13 talks about what the body of Christ will look when the fullness of the second covenant is manifested. No one will have to teach his neighbor to know God because all will know Him from the least to the greatest. I pray for that to come to pass–imagine what the world will look like when all will know God. Talk about Wow!
I think one of the biggest problems in the body of Christ is that we believers put our trust in other people and when they don’t react or act the way we think they should, we become disappointed and discouraged. Over the years, my mantra has become “put my trust in God alone, and love other people.” Through Christ and in the power of the Holy Spirit, God is our source and not other people. And, we have His promise that if we turn to Him, He will make all things work for our good. What a Father!
.-= patriciazell?s last blog ..#25 UNDERSTANDING CHRIST: HIS TRIUMPHANT CRUCIFIXION PART 2 =-.
This topic is one that we ministers usually become defensive about. As an evangelist myself and a PK (pastor’s kid), I have been able to witness this in the lives of others and my own as well. I have heard this complaint from ministers and lay people in the church.
Some ministers feel that their particular organization does not provide adequate food for them and the church members say the same about their church. It has been my experience that this is usually a part of the growing process. It doesn’t mean the grass is not nourishing or that the recipient is not “spiritual” enough. People grow and as they grow they will need different grass.
As ministers or church leader’s we must ask God that we also may continue to grow to meet the needs of others. I agree with you Anne, we must be interdependent of one another.
Sorry for not getting back sooner Anna. I think maybe Kyle said it better than I did. I am frustrated by those seeking the WOW moments and take off to the next best thing around where they can get the new high. I do believe that we need to feed each other or we will have a bunch of lone sheep with their own interpretation of the Word, going off half-cocked on some tangent. I have also been a recent victim of a small group that had no accountability and used one of their study sessions to paint a bunch of lies about me and the direction of the church. Even though there was an elder there to correct their false words, the damage was done and we lost about 10 people due to the “we can get it better somewhere else” syndrome. In this case though I had the idea of “don’t let the door hit you on the way out.” Sorry I have gone on so long. If I have misunderstood your post then forgive me for that. I do still believe you said some good things here.
.-= bill (cycleguy)?s last blog ..Warts and All =-.
Sorry Anne
.-= bill (cycleguy)?s last blog ..Warts and All =-.
Anne,
I saw this quote from one of your comments above:
“Some people aren?t willing to be fed, but others are starving to death desperate, doing what they can to eat in often barren fields.”
Very good. My heart especially goes out to people who live in places where the options are few.
I have a friend who traveled each Sunday AM to another city because of this issue and their belief that the church in that city was healthier for their family than the ones in their town. They made their trip to that church a sacred time for their family, filled with lots of conversation, and conversations about God.
.-= Jim Martin?s last blog ..Much Fear in Many Churches =-.
Anne, maybe it’s just me, but your blogs just seem to keep getting better and better. They do. (Loved the last few, especially.) You said your hubs helps you in how you write them – if this is the result, tell him he’s a keeper!
What you wrote today reminded me of several years ago, when we were babysitting kids from dysfunctional families (ie, if 3 kids, also 3 fathers). We took most of them to church. The reaction? The church didn’t want them. If they’d already been “nice,” yes. As they were, needy, no.
Same thing happened when we took a lady from a drug rehab program to church. They didn’t want her. Finally we gave up on that church and took everyone to another church, which did accept them. But after about a year, the lady from rehab decided to move back to her home town (pop. about 7,000). Again, she could not find ONE church of any denomination in that town that would accept her!
And when my own family went through a several-years sickness, we got ONE “how-are-you” phone call -what is it now?- five years.
I do wonder what God will same to some of our churches in the Judgment. We do have a lot to learn about shepherding!
how do you deal with something like that? I am finding it soul destroying and struggle to love God’s bride as he does. I know we aren’t supposed to judge God by the people in churches, but it sure makes it hard to talk to people about Jesus when churches are like this!
.-= Michelle George?s last blog ..Happy Anniversary Babe! =-.
Don’t expect people to be or do what they can’t be or do. We need to let go of our expectations of other people (because they will inevitably disappoint us) and focus on God’s absolute love for each one of us. His love is perfect, complete, and real–it will carry us through the challenges we face. Grab hold of God and don’t ever let go! Seek Him with everything you have and you will find the knowledge, understanding, and wisdom that only He can give.
.-= patriciazell?s last blog ..#25 UNDERSTANDING CHRIST: HIS TRIUMPHANT CRUCIFIXION PART 2 =-.
I understand that, and that’s the only thing that gets me through…how do I not expect anything from people who claim to be Jesus followers though? I still have to operate in the real world and interact with His church. I can’t be a lone ranger in my faith. I was saved to be in community with others on the journey. I’m not saying that I’ve got it all sorted by any stretch of the imagination, but how do I love an organism that seems intent on shooting their wounded?
.-= Michelle George?s last blog ..Happy Anniversary Babe! =-.
I think we all must realize that the world – including the church – is broken because each and every one of us is broken….
Let me play devils advocate then….( I have friends that ask this question all the time) … what difference does Jesus make then if the church is no different to the world?
He is what makes us holy and blameless in God’s sight. Even on our best days (or worst) God can not stand to look at our sin. No one is better or worse than another. The cross covers our best and our worst.
The Prodigal God by Keller is a quick book that is amazing. I highly recommend…
I saw the Prodigal God talk at the GLS..phenomenal stuff! I keep coming back to just focussing on Jesus and trusting that he will take me to a church that will help me heal. The word God has been giving me lately is to love my dysfunctional family and be the change I want to see (a la Ghandi) its hard work.
Michelle, I don’t know what Anne’s answer will be to that, but mine is simply: I try to learn from it. I look at myself and try to be sure I’m not repeating those same mistakes, which ARE very human. And do my best to love those churches anyway.
thanks Pete :)
I am not in church leadership. I am not a theologian. I am a little person striving to live out the Great Commission. If someone likes my “Greener Grass”, and wants to chat…Coffee.Tea.Bible Chat… Bring it, that’s how we grow, I feel..thru relationships. Listening. and, interjecting when prodded/convicted.
…gosh.. People need to L.I.S.T.E.N more!
Why don’t you invite someone to coffee or dinner and share conversation with them. People crave People.
Reese, you’re right. When people aren’t getting fed – or are “turned off” on their local church for any reason – that is indeed one way that can work. And God bless you for doing it!
Michelle, there are a couple other sides to the question of churches that don’t care, or don’t reach out, or don’t feed. Lots of that, unfortunately, is just human. We’re all that way sometimes. If we really look, we’ll probably all find times we’ve done things like that – even when we’re trying not to (I have.). Recognizing that makes it a lot easier to forgive the “human” failings in others, and to love them.
If you’re looking for a church that WILL accept needy, unruly kids, one of my suggestions is to look for a church with a good bus ministry. One of the first things they’ve had to do was learn how to love “unloved” kids like that.
But there is still heartbreak, and it’s not on just one side of the coin. For awhile we brought 3 kids from one family. The mother was a stripper (this is a mining town, and quite rough). The “father” was a succession of boyfriends, whoever she brought home from the club that night. One night, while my teen-age son was “sitting” the kids, the mom and her “friend” came home and got into a fight. She asked Bill to call 911. The guy told Bill “no, don’t.” She repeated her plea. Finally Bill picked up the phone and got the numbers dialed. The “boyfriend” came at him and said “I told you not do do that.” Bill quickly hung the phone up, but it was enough; the police came.
Besides danger, there was honest-to-goodness heartbreak. And NOT all the church’s fault. One Sunday School teacher went around the room and asked each child to make a prayer request, which the whole class would pray for. One of the little boys in the family we brought asked that the class would pray that his mother wouldn’t beat him anymore. Then he went home and told his stripper mother exactly what he’d asked. As you’d expect, his mother hit the ceiling. No more Sunday School for him! And soon after that they moved away. We still wonder where and how those kids are, but we’ve heard no more from them.
But we ARE supposed to love kids like that as if they were Jesus. And we still try, as we can.
I’ve been a believer for a long long time now and I’m a big believer in taking the time to feed myself spiritually and to nurture that part of my life. But I do believe that we as the body can provide a beautiful, rich, healing meal for each other as well.
We need community and connectedness to thrive. Personally, it’s not about a church program, small group, activity etc. But I do need to feel like my life matters to someone. For several years it was hard for me to get out of my house at all until later at night. Some of my friends met me every Thursday night at about 9:30 and were my lifeline and support. They were his heart and His hands to me. I didn’t experience that at all from my church. I couldn’t fit into any of the time frames for any of the meetings or ministries there. Sometimes we are all weak. Sometimes we are all weary. Sometimes having someone come along side us who loves us… hopes the best from us … and who isn’t looking at us as a project is an amazing feast in itself.
.-= Linda B.?s last blog ..My Life Is Not Twitteriffic =-.
Not every field has the same grass, and I don’t know where all of the fields are. Only the Great Shepherd has that map.
In other words, I can do my best to feed the flock in the field with which I am familiar. As I grow as a leader and as a believer, I am more apt to locate and lead someone to the right pasture.
Not every sheep is to remain in my fold but is to be relocated to another where the grass suits them better. I leave this up to the Great Shepherd who knows all of the folds, which He owns, and all of the shepherds who work them. I’ve even helped some sheep in our fold find new pasture by getting to know other shepherds in the community and pointing them in a direction.
If they can’t eat the grass here, I can’t always change that, but I can point them in the direction of someone who can.
I like what you have to say here.